BG

[Menace651]

(08-09-2016 09:51 PM)GM-Rahice Wrote:  We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be, please continue to post suggestions or ideas about BG, we'll take it all into consideration. ^_^

My suggestion is have Rahice come @nukeall at the beggining of every BG round and tie everyone. We won't have to waste time /dice or breaking supply depots.

[Summerstream]

(08-09-2016 10:41 PM)Menace651 Wrote:  

(08-09-2016 09:51 PM)GM-Rahice Wrote:  We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be, please continue to post suggestions or ideas about BG, we'll take it all into consideration. ^_^

My suggestion is have Rahice come @nukeall at the beggining of every BG round and tie everyone. We won't have to waste time /dice or breaking supply depots.

I like this suggestion.

A lot.

[VietNam90]

Quote:We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be, please continue to post suggestions or ideas about BG, we'll take it all into consideration. ^_^

God tiem and the MVP card alway attractive in BG, there is a difference in the Hero-server and cant find anywhere else
with Terra and Mini woe it would be a great thing

Allow God item and MVP card enable in BG
and not work in Woe

[Poofy]

(08-09-2016 09:51 PM)GM-Rahice Wrote:  We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be

GM-Garr Wrote:BG exp gain was reduced 10 times

Not going to lie, lot of people are pretty upset and felt this was sprung on them, me included and I was watching this thread to see a GMs take on it before saying more. There wasn't any indication of the change being this huge and it wasn't even listed in a changelog before the maintenance, only after. Now it's lower then what officials would give at x1.

Maybe I didn't give a strong opinion but I figured there'd be some clarity in the direction that the GMs felt would be best before putting it into effect. There was a bit of a blow up on main about players feeling ill informed, and I completely agree.

On a sidenote, this didn't fix the main thing I thought people were mad about. About a third of the BGs I've been in since maintenance still /dice. I thought this is the core of what people were actually frustrated about, that people would do nothing and get what it is they were after when others wanted to play the game mode? I was under the impression people would be more okay with the experience if they put more effort into the game mode, this is why there was suggestions like only the winners getting points and stuff like that. Eh, maybe I'm wrong...

[Aaronock]

I think the issue was that people were using it as a means to mostly gain experience rather than to get points for gears.

Fixing the Dice issue is difficult and a problem every server faces.

[Menace651]

(08-15-2016 11:25 PM)Poofy Wrote:  

(08-09-2016 09:51 PM)GM-Rahice Wrote:  We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be

GM-Garr Wrote:BG exp gain was reduced 10 times

Not going to lie, lot of people are pretty upset and felt this was sprung on them, me included and I was watching this thread to see a GMs take on it before saying more. There wasn't any indication of the change being this huge and it wasn't even listed in a changelog before the maintenance, only after. Now it's lower then what officials would give at x1.

Maybe I didn't give a strong opinion but I figured there'd be some clarity in the direction that the GMs felt would be best before putting it into effect. There was a bit of a blow up on main about players feeling ill informed, and I completely agree.

On a sidenote, this didn't fix the main thing I thought people were mad about. About a third of the BGs I've been in since maintenance still /dice. I thought this is the core of what people were actually frustrated about, that people would do nothing and get what it is they were after when others wanted to play the game mode? I was under the impression people would be more okay with the experience if they put more effort into the game mode, this is why there was suggestions like only the winners getting points and stuff like that. Eh, maybe I'm wrong...

I for one agree with the EXP nerf. I don't remember how much exp official server BG gave but someone sitting at BG should not make more exp in 5 minutes than someone in an actual pvm party.

As far as BG dicing and farming goes, if people want to do it let them. People do it on other servers and will do it here too. I've already offered my suggestions for making it more competitive. You also can't expect newer players to compete with veterans who have been around for years that have unlimited resources and gears. Dicing is kind of an equalizer IMO.

[Poofy]

If the objective was to make BG a place that couldn't be abused this was blown far, far past. It's not even an incentive anymore, the experience amount might as well be zero. This to me seemed like an opportunity to allow the influx of newer players to "catch up" and to be able to play battlegrounds somewhat consistently with a population interested in it. In my first post I stated that the biggest thing I personally want is just for the game mode to be played, and not abused. I feel like this is drastic enough that it won't be abused OR played. Am I just not seeing the players who were doing the exp abuse stacking, or was it just one or two people who ruined it for everyone? I've made friends with a lot of the newer players and BG was more of a downtime form of experience when they didn't have the members on to party at places that gave much more exp then BGs even in the old state.

I feel like everyone who wanted it to change thinks everyone else who liked it before is selfish, and everyone who liked it before think people who wanted the change were being selfish/prideful about how hard it was "back in my day". Why couldn't this just be an incentive to get people to play a fun game mode that is known for dying on any server with a lower population?

Also, I think the big point was missed where most people stated in main they were frustrated by the lack of communication. Myself and a couple of guildies followed this thread for an update and maybe we read too hard into the GMs post but we felt like we would be in the know of what the GMs thought might be the right direction before it happened. There wasn't a strong enough statement made by the staff at all that had us believe this would just be sprung on us, even though the GMs aren't shy about giving their thoughts on the forums on what action they think should be taken. Instead it's just a couple of key forum members making a couple of posts about how they don't like newer players getting experience this way and it being changed in under two weeks, no maintenance note, no post in here, nothing.

[Yokura]

I find the sudden change very jarring. I, after seeing

(08-09-2016 09:51 PM)GM-Rahice Wrote:  We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be, please continue to post suggestions or ideas about BG, we'll take it all into consideration. ^_^

just kind of assumed that there would be a formal decision posted here, or somewhere visible, before being implemented. That there wasn't, makes me feel a little like the rug was pulled from underneath me.

Matters of communication aside, I am honestly just very sad to see that BG will probably completely wither up after this change. When I first came to the server, I had assumed there would be no BG scene due to how low the population was. BG is my #1 favorite thing to do in RO ever, especially Flavius; I love that game mode so much it was legit the most fun I have had in RO when I played on one server where the population was capable of running BG 12 hours out of the day.

When I did see that there were indeed people playing BG flash at the top of my screen, I was super happy to see a BG scene. You could say that that would have happily been my end game for this game; playing BG endlessly. PVP rooms are far too bland with mindless wandering, and WOE is too much time intensive prep for a once a week battle of pride to me. I love BG's arena setup, so I did actually look forward to the times when BG was running so that I could build up BG gear and actually competently play BG. I was also extremely disappointed to see that /dice was always the meta, but I didn't mind too much because the fact that there were PEOPLE IN BG meant that it wasn't out of the question to ask for real battles to be played by people who were interested at least a little bit. That or actually killing people in BG would do the trick too, probably. They might be mad but when you're sitting in a pvp room you don't get to be entitled to staying alive. But there were people in BG! This was the biggest hope for me that it would be a game mode that I could actually play.

With this new change, I will be heartbroken if it turns out that there will be no one in BG. I just don't see the point in lowering the exp. As a matter of fact, I don't see a point in having exp there to begin with. But it gave people incentive to just be there and to me that was invaluable. EXP being there was never a deciding factor for me because I want to play BG because it's BG. When I saw this thread I thought that it would be changed in such a way that the same people would play the game instead of dicing to get the same rewards. Did you just want to make it so that exp afk dicing was banished entirely? Was that honestly all that you wanted to do? It will certainly remove exp farming via BG, but dicing will probably stick around because it's just more efficient that way. If the intent was to make BG played instead of abused, you achieved nothing, just less BGs. Players will probably still dice to get points for gear. There'll just be less people doing it.

You punished your "cheaters" and your BG players.
Previously:
The person who wanted exp played BG when it was up and diced
The person who wanted points played BG when it was up and diced
The person who wanted to play BG played BG when it was up

Now:
The person who wants exp doesn't play BG
The person who want points plays BG when it is up and dices
The person who wants to play BG play BG when it is up

Less people now, and since BG requires people to start, all it will do is reduce the amount of BG arenas that are started now. Which are depressingly low.

With a server of low pop, BG will likely never feasibly be an active game mode without an incentive or some persistent passionate game starters. It's already much easier to get BG gear on heRO than it is on most other servers; despite that it's still not really played. Because the bar of entry to BG will always be the number of players, removing traffic removes the ability to play BG. And on a low pop server, it will never meet the minimum sweet spot where BG is consistently played without a lot of help. It's just crushing to see that it will likely change from "People played BG for exp" to "A few people try to play BG every so often." If people are in the room, it is much better than no one in the room to me.

I just want to play BG.

If you wanted to banish exp farmers from BG, just reduce it to zero. At least then it is clear what the intent was.

In fact, if EXP farming was the problem, why on earth does the Puppy quest in Brasilis implemented? I've always wondered that as a new player; On a server where repeatable quests are removed, why is there an even easier quest available for exp? What sense does that make? Monsters of the moment make it super easy to level to begin with.

[The Roger]

Then go do Puppy quest. Whats the problem? BG is to fight for points.

And if Someone complains because other players fights during "their" dice bg, that Someone is wrong.


There is one thing that aggravates this problem: players full-geared and skilled... who dice. I wont make names but lets say i saw many times a pecouser class who was dicing with the other "new players" and if you wanted to fight (being in the opposite team of he/she) he/she simply destroys you (because as i said was full-geared, extra-potted and skillful) so they could go on with "their" dicing.
I wasnt able to fight him/her alone.

That player with that behavior was encouraging non-fights BGs. If he/she instead fought, he/she was able to gain way more points for sure, and other players not yet at his/her level simply had to leech like half of RO game is, and they will be forced to improve themselves with gears/skills and teamworks to overcome a stronger player to win BG and gain more points instead of the peasant life of a leecher.
There will be then more active fights and a healthier BG environment.

The better solution to face the dicing problem, is fighting.

You, out there: go BG and Fight. If you dont fight, you dont really win, even if you gain 6 points.

PS: i would like to have an official statement that allows reporting BG players who /dice, for a lets say some hours/1 day of jail (if supported by proves like recording/screenshots)

[hachigatsu30]

I really hate to do this because it means I repeated myself. /sigh

(08-06-2016 02:06 PM)hachigatsu30 Wrote:  2. BG matches can be fixed. Well, there's basically nothing we can do about this imo. If there's a way to win, there's always a way to fix the win. So don't QQ over the fact that some people decides to /dice or blue-team-are-losers or whatever is used to fix the winner of a match. And in all fairness, please, don't QQ either if someone decides to be a nasty little prankster and starts shoving his spears up everybody's behinds.

Sure, illegalize /dice in BG. Then what? Red Team wins. Illegalize that too? Then what if Red Team indeed wins fair and square? How do you prove that? Chat log screenshot? Then they move to something else, like party chat, and deciding to kill (or let die) whoever wants to fight that would be screenshotting. Then what? Illegalize party in BG? Then they will move to guild chat. Then what?